summary: today chat was overtaken by Engine-ers concentrated on sync/async message flows (1.7 in http://wiki.apache.org/ws/FrontPage/Architecture/Engine) phased deployment, and details of engine prototypes.

tentatively Engine discussion continues next week.

the week after that chat time will start to rotate between 10PM EST and 9AM EST check http://wiki.apache.org/ws/ChatAgenda and mailing list for details and confirmed chat times.

thanks,

alek

[11/3/2004 9:03 AM] <Ajith> can we start?
[11/3/2004 9:03 AM] <drnknmnky> but how can I avoid hard coding a path like C:\....\client-config.wsdd in my code?
[11/3/2004 9:03 AM] <Srinath> cool :)
[11/3/2004 9:03 AM] <Jaliya> Shall we start the "engnie"
[11/3/2004 9:03 AM] <Srinath> put it in ur project folder and put a relative path :D
[11/3/2004 9:03 AM] -->| Chinthaka (~chinthaka@220.247.250.92) has joined #apache-axis
[11/3/2004 9:04 AM] <Chinthaka> hi all
[11/3/2004 9:04 AM] <Srinath> see http://wiki.apache.org/ws/FrontPage/Architecture/Engine 1.7
[11/3/2004 9:04 AM] <Srinath> see 1.7
[11/3/2004 9:05 AM] <Srinath> forget to remane call there to sender :(
[11/3/2004 9:05 AM] <Srinath> will do it
[11/3/2004 9:05 AM] <Ajith> no prob
[11/3/2004 9:05 AM] <Ajith> we can live with it for a day :D
[11/3/2004 9:06 AM] -->| sanjiva (~sanjiva@203.94.84.117) has joined #apache-axis
[11/3/2004 9:06 AM] <sanjiva> hi guys
[11/3/2004 9:06 AM] <Ajith> hi
[11/3/2004 9:06 AM] <Srinath> I had put sequance Digrams http://wiki.apache.org/ws/FrontPage/Architecture/Engine
[11/3/2004 9:07 AM] <Srinath> see 1.7
[11/3/2004 9:07 AM] <Srinath> :)
[11/3/2004 9:07 AM] =-= YOU are now known as alek_s
[11/3/2004 9:07 AM] <alek_s> hello
[11/3/2004 9:07 AM] <Srinath> Hi Alek
[11/3/2004 9:08 AM] <Ajith> hi alek
[11/3/2004 9:08 AM] <alek_s> everybody afraid OM discussion will fill all available time :)
[11/3/2004 9:08 AM] <Ajith> yep
[11/3/2004 9:09 AM] <Ajith> we keep on talking OM and ignore the rest :)
[11/3/2004 9:09 AM] <Srinath> which is usual :D
[11/3/2004 9:09 AM] <Ajith> So this time we'll devote some time to engine
[11/3/2004 9:09 AM] <Chinthaka> thats good
[11/3/2004 9:09 AM] <Srinath> cool .. am kiding
[11/3/2004 9:09 AM] <alek_s> sure (but please update agenda so i can sleep loger ;->)
[11/3/2004 9:10 AM] <Ajith> :D
[11/3/2004 9:10 AM] <Chinthaka> I think its better if we can base our chat on what Srinath has pointed out
[11/3/2004 9:10 AM] <Srinath> ooooooooooopssssssssssssssssss
[11/3/2004 9:10 AM] <Chinthaka> :|
[11/3/2004 9:11 AM] <Ajith> Ok where to start??
[11/3/2004 9:11 AM] <Srinath> from the diagrams
[11/3/2004 9:11 AM] <Srinath> go one by one .. but we miss glen
[11/3/2004 9:12 AM] <Jaliya> i think that is a good idea, we will go through the sequence diagrams
[11/3/2004 9:13 AM] <Srinath> let us hav more attention on what happen on providers ..
[11/3/2004 9:13 AM] <Srinath> which is bit wage
[11/3/2004 9:13 AM] <Chinthaka> I corrected some spelling mistakes, but I can't do that on diagrams
[11/3/2004 9:14 AM] <Ajith> yeah why dont we  talk about the "providers"
[11/3/2004 9:15 AM] <Srinath> will correct them .. hav a hard time drwing them .. get to know how one feel enrangle in a web :D
[11/3/2004 9:15 AM] <Deepal> any way we can go through the diagram
[11/3/2004 9:16 AM] <Ajith> yeah dont let a simple spelling mistake bother you :D
[11/3/2004 9:16 AM] <Srinath> Providers are we braking it to smallparts
[11/3/2004 9:16 AM] <alek_s> what  green, red, blue lines stand for (scenarios?)
[11/3/2004 9:17 AM] <Ajith> Blue is return of ontro;
[11/3/2004 9:17 AM] <Ajith> control
[11/3/2004 9:17 AM] <Srinath> green is send .. might be in a differant thread
[11/3/2004 9:18 AM] <Srinath> sorry get confused
[11/3/2004 9:18 AM] <Srinath> green is for client specific
[11/3/2004 9:18 AM] <Srinath> but I hav mess it a bit .. the sender onward it is balck
[11/3/2004 9:19 AM] <Ajith> Yeah the red lines also seem to confuse me
[11/3/2004 9:19 AM] <Jaliya> Shall we take a one diagram and have a little explanation
[11/3/2004 9:20 AM] <Ajith> that is the best
[11/3/2004 9:20 AM] <Chinthaka> thats good way to start jaliya
[11/3/2004 9:20 AM] <Deepal> so lets talk abt 1.7.1.1. Diagram
[11/3/2004 9:20 AM] <Jaliya> Ok, 1.7.2. Sync Server
[11/3/2004 9:22 AM] <Ajith> Sync server means the client stays for a ack?
[11/3/2004 9:22 AM] <alek_s> maybe better to explain flow of control is to have an wxample with two service peers: one initiator and another responder? (traditionally client and server but i would try to avoid calling something client as it gets confusing because client acts as "server" when receiving async response ...)
[11/3/2004 9:23 AM] <Jaliya> I think, we can go through the sequence diagram,
[11/3/2004 9:24 AM] <Deepal> bt in 1.7.2.1. Archi Diagram
[11/3/2004 9:24 AM] <Deepal> it has new thread
[11/3/2004 9:24 AM] <Ajith> oops there is a new theread that does not belong there!!!
[11/3/2004 9:25 AM] <Srinath> pls ignore the componet diagams for a bit e.g. new Thread in the Sunc server that sholud not there
[11/3/2004 9:25 AM] <alek_s> what is Hook? it is on Sequence diagram but on Archi?
[11/3/2004 9:25 AM] <Ajith> ok so its the same thread
[11/3/2004 9:25 AM] <Srinath> ignore the archi for now
[11/3/2004 9:25 AM] -->| gdaniels (~gdaniels@psc.progress.com) has joined #apache-axis
[11/3/2004 9:25 AM] <Deepal> hi glen
[11/3/2004 9:25 AM] <Ajith> Hi Glen
[11/3/2004 9:26 AM] <Srinath> hook is where we left msgctx so Call can get ti back
[11/3/2004 9:26 AM] <gdaniels> Morning folks!  Sorry I'm late... alarm didn't go off in time. :(
[11/3/2004 9:26 AM] -->| farhaan (~Miranda@203.143.53.23) has joined #apache-axis
[11/3/2004 9:26 AM] <alek_s> hello Glen
[11/3/2004 9:26 AM] <Deepal> glen go to this http://wiki.apache.org/ws/FrontPage/Architecture/Engine
[11/3/2004 9:26 AM] <Chinthaka> hi (Farhan, Glen)
[11/3/2004 9:26 AM] <Srinath> Hi Glen .. we missed you since we are in the engine
[11/3/2004 9:26 AM] <alek_s> Glen: it must 6 am-ish :)
[11/3/2004 9:26 AM] <gdaniels> Yup
[11/3/2004 9:26 AM] <Jaliya> Hi  Glen and Farhaan
[11/3/2004 9:27 AM] <gdaniels> Engine good - what are we discussing?
[11/3/2004 9:28 AM] <Deepal> abt sequence diagram in that page
[11/3/2004 9:28 AM] <Srinath> pls update ur link s I remove the compont diagrams ..only sequnce diagrams thr now
[11/3/2004 9:28 AM] <Srinath> we model a set of sequnce diagrms for the sync sync flow
[11/3/2004 9:28 AM] <Chinthaka> we have a proposal for the engine and we were discussing abt that
[11/3/2004 9:28 AM] <Srinath> the Respoder = Sender
[11/3/2004 9:29 AM] <Jaliya> need to discuss more about the provider and the operation
[11/3/2004 9:29 AM] <Srinath> from summit discussion
[11/3/2004 9:29 AM] <gdaniels> OK.  I haven't read your code yet, unfortunately.  :(  CommonExecutor?
[11/3/2004 9:29 AM] <Srinath> :D
[11/3/2004 9:30 AM] <Chinthaka> CommonExecutor is the name given for Global, Transport and Service
[11/3/2004 9:30 AM] <Srinath> that is common class for Service, transport ..
[11/3/2004 9:30 AM] <gdaniels> so it's the thing that has receive() and send() on it
[11/3/2004 9:30 AM] <Srinath> yap:)
[11/3/2004 9:31 AM] <Srinath> engine calling the common Executers
[11/3/2004 9:31 AM] <gdaniels> Where do phases come in?
[11/3/2004 9:31 AM] <Srinath> we need to discuss it?
[11/3/2004 9:32 AM] <Ajith> inside commonExecutors!
[11/3/2004 9:32 AM] <Srinath> the common exectuers can rsolve phases
[11/3/2004 9:32 AM] <Jaliya> or engine resolves phases
[11/3/2004 9:32 AM] <gdaniels> ok - so AxisEngine implements CommonExecutor?
[11/3/2004 9:32 AM] <Srinath> we got to go more detail in to the Phased handelers
[11/3/2004 9:33 AM] <Chinthaka> oops no
[11/3/2004 9:33 AM] <Srinath> it should .. I think it is not yet
[11/3/2004 9:33 AM] <Chinthaka> Engine calls a commonexecutor
[11/3/2004 9:33 AM] <Ajith> Glen :  I guess not
[11/3/2004 9:33 AM] <Srinath> Glen .. engine is a common Executer:)
[11/3/2004 9:33 AM] <Ajith> Hmm come to think of it "why not"
[11/3/2004 9:34 AM] <gdaniels> Srinath : +1, I think so too (not having looked at the interface in detail)
[11/3/2004 9:34 AM] <Srinath> we have not write "im[plements CommonExecuter"
[11/3/2004 9:34 AM] <Ajith> yeah I guess we can model it that way too
[11/3/2004 9:34 AM] <gdaniels> ok
[11/3/2004 9:35 AM] <Srinath> glen : about the Pahsed handlers .. does handlers itsefl create the info about where it goese in to
[11/3/2004 9:35 AM] <gdaniels> Srinath : No (or at least not usually) - I think it's deployment metadata
[11/3/2004 9:35 AM] <Srinath> mean can a common executer can resolve the pahsed when it only get the Handlers
[11/3/2004 9:36 AM] <gdaniels> Did you take a look at the code I checked in re: Phases?
[11/3/2004 9:36 AM] <Srinath> will look in my eclipse
[11/3/2004 9:37 AM] <Srinath> cool but how they DispatchPhase get the info
[11/3/2004 9:38 AM] <gdaniels> I have the AxisEngine creating an appropriate ExecutionChain each time it gets invoked
[11/3/2004 9:38 AM] <gdaniels> see AxisEngine.receive()
[11/3/2004 9:38 AM] <gdaniels> right now it hard codes which phases it has, but that will clearly need to change
[11/3/2004 9:39 AM] <Ajith> Hmmm
[11/3/2004 9:39 AM] <Srinath>  chain.addPhase(Constants.GLOBAL_RECEIVE, new Phase());
[11/3/2004 9:39 AM] <Srinath>         chain.addPhase("dispatch", new DispatchPhase());
[11/3/2004 9:39 AM] <Srinath>         chain.addPhase("service", new Phase());
[11/3/2004 9:39 AM] <Srinath> I think
[11/3/2004 9:39 AM] <gdaniels> right
[11/3/2004 9:39 AM] <Jaliya> Glen: So does that mean, the all the handlers are arranged using the deployment metadata
[11/3/2004 9:39 AM] <Ajith> Glen :  this means engine has the responsibility of arranging the handlers? is it?
[11/3/2004 9:39 AM] <gdaniels> Jaliya - right.  Some combination of hard-coded stuff and deployment stuff
[11/3/2004 9:39 AM] <gdaniels> Ajith: It doesn't have to be the engine exactly, that's just how I modeled it in this toy.
[11/3/2004 9:40 AM] <gdaniels> But the Engine seems like a fine place for it.
[11/3/2004 9:40 AM] <Srinath> I think Glen you assumed that the pahse can get the rules from the handlers itdelf
[11/3/2004 9:40 AM] <Ajith> The way we have it now I think even the commonExec can arrange its own handlers
[11/3/2004 9:40 AM] <gdaniels> Which rules do you mean?
[11/3/2004 9:40 AM] <Srinath> i am going first , last ect ..
[11/3/2004 9:41 AM] <Srinath> rules about the handlers
[11/3/2004 9:41 AM] <gdaniels> That stuff comes from deployment.
[11/3/2004 9:41 AM] <Ajith> I think Srinath means rules like H1 comes before H2 and all
[11/3/2004 9:41 AM] <Jaliya> Ajith : But between commonexecutors how we can arrnage
[11/3/2004 9:41 AM] <Srinath> and Handlers have referance to there Metadata
[11/3/2004 9:41 AM] <gdaniels> There's a thing called a Supplier which knows how to deploy things to ExecutionChains.
[11/3/2004 9:41 AM] <Srinath> ?
[11/3/2004 9:41 AM] <Ajith> we can tdo it betweeb CE's
[11/3/2004 9:41 AM] <gdaniels> Suppliers are what lives in the Registry
[11/3/2004 9:41 AM] <Chinthaka> can we hand over the arranging of handlers to the CommonExecutors
[11/3/2004 9:41 AM] <Ajith> we can only do it within a CE
[11/3/2004 9:42 AM] <Deepal> if u go to this like u can get some idea abt phase http://wiki.apache.org/ws/FrontPage/Architecture/Deployment
[11/3/2004 9:42 AM] <Jaliya> Glen can you please explain a bit on suppliers
[11/3/2004 9:42 AM] <Deepal> 1.6.1 and 1.6.2
[11/3/2004 9:43 AM] <gdaniels> I'm bringing up your code now, Srinath...
[11/3/2004 9:43 AM] <Jaliya> so the engine is using supplier to get the handlers for it to invoke and supplier know everything about handlers (phases etc..) am I right?
[11/3/2004 9:43 AM] <gdaniels> Jaliya, sure
[11/3/2004 9:43 AM] <gdaniels> Yup
[11/3/2004 9:44 AM] <gdaniels> The deployment system is just responsible for loading up the Registry with the right Suppliers
[11/3/2004 9:44 AM] <Srinath> glen: my concern is can we assume the Handlers are self contianed .. and whoever get the handlers cwe can ask each what are ur rules and reolve phase using them
[11/3/2004 9:44 AM] <Ajith> Hmmm , this is a problamatic situation for the common executors
[11/3/2004 9:45 AM] <gdaniels> Srinath - but you can't do that
[11/3/2004 9:45 AM] <Srinath> ok .. glen I think I get it.. supplier order the handlers before put them ?
[11/3/2004 9:45 AM] <sanjiva> Srinath: someone outsoude of a single handler author has to know the order ..
[11/3/2004 9:45 AM] <gdaniels> A given handler might need to be put on multiple phases
[11/3/2004 9:45 AM] <gdaniels> Or used in different phases at different times
[11/3/2004 9:45 AM] <gdaniels> sanjiva: +1
[11/3/2004 9:45 AM] <sanjiva> when I write the security handler I don't know when I need to run that .. relatiive to RM etc
[11/3/2004 9:45 AM] <Ajith> What I thoughts was that Phases wont intersect Transport,Global and Service
[11/3/2004 9:45 AM] <Srinath> yap accepted :) +1
[11/3/2004 9:45 AM] <sanjiva> engine, the master of all knowledge, will have to manage the ordering ...
[11/3/2004 9:46 AM] <sanjiva> ordering == phases
[11/3/2004 9:46 AM] <gdaniels> With a little help from the deployment system
[11/3/2004 9:46 AM] <Jaliya> +1 it is cool
[11/3/2004 9:46 AM] <Ajith> Sanjiva : Whay cant we put delegate that to CE's
[11/3/2004 9:46 AM] <Srinath> yes that mean we can get the Registry published with correct order
[11/3/2004 9:46 AM] <gdaniels> The system has some firm rules (i.e. dispath phase comes last, etc), and beyond that the deployment/engine combo has the knowledge
[11/3/2004 9:47 AM] <gdaniels> Ajith: What's a CE, exactly? (my IDE is loading your stuff now)
[11/3/2004 9:47 AM] <gdaniels> Is it just an invocation interface, or do you think it should have deployment semantics?
[11/3/2004 9:47 AM] <Srinath> +1 glen to put it resolving pahses  one place
[11/3/2004 9:48 AM] <Srinath> CE is all about the real thing .. it do not have metadata
[11/3/2004 9:48 AM] <Ajith> Glen : CE is a collection of Handlers
[11/3/2004 9:48 AM] <Srinath> e.g. have Handler .. not HnanderDesc's
[11/3/2004 9:49 AM] <Ajith> When  send of a CE is called it invokes send of a set of handlers
[11/3/2004 9:49 AM] <gdaniels> gotcha
[11/3/2004 9:49 AM] <Ajith> more like the chain
[11/3/2004 9:49 AM] <Srinath> glen : can you add few words about ExecutionFrame
[11/3/2004 9:49 AM] <--| _chris_|tv-bush has left #apache-axis ("Leaving")
[11/3/2004 9:50 AM] <Ajith> So what i figured is that a CE may be able to internally order its handlers
[11/3/2004 9:50 AM] <Deepal> Ajith how CE order those
[11/3/2004 9:50 AM] <gdaniels> ExecutionFrame is an old class - shouldn't have been in there
[11/3/2004 9:51 AM] <gdaniels> I was using it to do the pause/resume stuff
[11/3/2004 9:51 AM] <Srinath> ? do not get you yet
[11/3/2004 9:51 AM] <gdaniels> Now I do that all in ExecutionChain and AxisEngine
[11/3/2004 9:51 AM] <Jaliya> me too
[11/3/2004 9:52 AM] <Ajith> Deepal : a CE has the resposibility of calling a set of handlers, so it might as well order it when calling them
[11/3/2004 9:52 AM] <gdaniels> if you look in ExecutionChain.invoke() you'll see that if a given Handler returns false, we return
[11/3/2004 9:52 AM] <gdaniels> that "pauses" the execution
[11/3/2004 9:53 AM] <gdaniels> the EC still knows where we are (keeps indices)
[11/3/2004 9:53 AM] <gdaniels> so later you can call MessageContext.resume() and have it start up again
[11/3/2004 9:53 AM] <sanjiva> Ajith: is it correct to say that CE is a container for a set of handlers working in a single phase?
[11/3/2004 9:53 AM] <Jaliya> Ok, Help for RM
[11/3/2004 9:53 AM] <Jaliya> so we can order the messages
[11/3/2004 9:53 AM] <gdaniels> Jaliya - right, or any other async processing that might be needed
[11/3/2004 9:54 AM] <Ajith> Sanjiva : mmm "yes"
[11/3/2004 9:54 AM] <gdaniels> managing priorities, etc
[11/3/2004 9:54 AM] <Ajith> you can put it that way
[11/3/2004 9:54 AM] <gdaniels> in fact, the ExecutionChain should be able to be pause()d externally too
[11/3/2004 9:54 AM] <Srinath> thanks glen: should be ok pausing.. do not get insigt into it yet:)
[11/3/2004 9:54 AM] <alek_s> I am not sure if pause/resume is enouh for WS-RM - i think it needs also to save state so if server is restarted no messages are lost ...
[11/3/2004 9:55 AM] <gdaniels> +1 Alek, persistence should be in there too
[11/3/2004 9:55 AM] <Jaliya> yes, we need to store the state + the message
[11/3/2004 9:55 AM] <sanjiva> Ajith: If you say yes you have to agree that the ordering of phases cannot be inside the CE .. it has to be in the engine
[11/3/2004 9:55 AM] <gdaniels> I just didn't add that in this first prototype/toy
[11/3/2004 9:56 AM] <gdaniels> sanjiva: +1, although we may want to give individual Handlers the ability to reorder things/add phases.... maybe.
[11/3/2004 9:56 AM] <Ajith> Glen : we plan to keep the Message Context with all the state so if you snapshot the MC it is the state
[11/3/2004 9:56 AM] <gdaniels> Ajith : +1
[11/3/2004 9:56 AM] <Srinath> about CE I belive we should them in th engine +1
[11/3/2004 9:56 AM] <Srinath> the pased logic
[11/3/2004 9:57 AM] <Ajith> Sanjiva : So thi means that the concpt of service,global and transport is not there anymore ????
[11/3/2004 9:57 AM] <alek_s> so MessageContext is either serializable or convertible to some persistent format (like XML ...)
[11/3/2004 9:57 AM] <sanjiva> those are just phases .. they are still there!
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[11/3/2004 9:57 AM] <gdaniels> alek : yes, but it needs to manage the persistence itself
[11/3/2004 9:57 AM] <Srinath> are we resolve the phases in the runitme or the deployment time?
[11/3/2004 9:57 AM] <sanjiva> however we will have more phases .. "predispatch", "postdispatch" etc.
[11/3/2004 9:57 AM] <Ajith> Alek : yes
[11/3/2004 9:57 AM] <gdaniels> sanjiva: +1
[11/3/2004 9:58 AM] <sanjiva> Srinath: IMO phases are resolved at deployment time .. for perf sake
[11/3/2004 9:58 AM] <sanjiva> That is, engine registry has a list of phases for each service after the service is deployed .. doesn't have to be computed when messages arrive
[11/3/2004 9:58 AM] <Jaliya> Can we find a scenario where handlers are pahsed at runtime
[11/3/2004 9:58 AM] <gdaniels> One thing I'm psyched about in my impl is the Phase interface having preconditions and postconditions - I think that's a nice way to implement stuff like "the service must be set after dispatch"
[11/3/2004 9:58 AM] <Srinath> sir: that means we populate them in to regitrty in rigt order
[11/3/2004 9:59 AM] <sanjiva> Srinath: +1
[11/3/2004 9:59 AM] <chathura> hi all (think im really really late today)
[11/3/2004 9:59 AM] <gdaniels> Srinath: +1
[11/3/2004 9:59 AM] <Ajith> Srinath : Ok I agree but I am still thinking that if handler ordering can be delegated down to componenets then we can keep the engine simpler
[11/3/2004 9:59 AM] <sanjiva> Glen: pre/post conditions: I am ok with the concept but concerned about perf .. let's start small and grow up :)
[11/3/2004 9:59 AM] <Srinath> ok .. I think thigs are cool that way
[11/3/2004 9:59 AM] <gdaniels> Once deployment is done, you should have 99% of the ordering done.
[11/3/2004 9:59 AM] <sanjiva> That is: boolean preconditionSatisfied() { return true; }
[11/3/2004 9:59 AM] <sanjiva> Glen: what's the 1%??
[11/3/2004 10:00 AM] <gdaniels> Actually right now it's void checkPrecondition() throws Exception
[11/3/2004 10:00 AM] <sanjiva> Oh wait its the policy negotiation stuff .. never mind .. at start of a conversation with a client
[11/3/2004 10:00 AM] <gdaniels> so the default impl is {} :)
[11/3/2004 10:00 AM] <Chinthaka> Ajith : so the modification we require is we remove CEs, and engine gets the ordered set of handlers from the engine registry and execute them in that order without a CE
[11/3/2004 10:00 AM] <sanjiva> glen: +1 :-)
[11/3/2004 10:00 AM] <gdaniels> sanjiva: yup
[11/3/2004 10:00 AM] <alek_s> 1%? maybe there can be "conditional" and "loop" handlers - starts to sound like workflow :)
[11/3/2004 10:00 AM] <Srinath> glen +1 :)
[11/3/2004 10:01 AM] <gdaniels> alek : you've discovered our secret plan to turn Axis into a workflow engine in 2006!
[11/3/2004 10:01 AM] <alek_s> ;-)
[11/3/2004 10:01 AM] <Srinath> :D
[11/3/2004 10:01 AM] <Jaliya> yes, we may have a scenario where we go throug a handler twice
[11/3/2004 10:01 AM] <Ajith> Chinthaka :  hmm it seems that we need to turn the tables on our terminology :D
[11/3/2004 10:01 AM] <alek_s> just a thing about mechanics
[11/3/2004 10:01 AM] <Jaliya> I mean depending on the conditions
[11/3/2004 10:02 AM] <gdaniels> So this CommonExecutor thing - how many things aside from the Engine implement that?
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[11/3/2004 10:02 AM] <alek_s> BTW: i have updated chat agenda for next week and week after that
[11/3/2004 10:02 AM] <Chinthaka> glen : Transport, Global and Service
[11/3/2004 10:02 AM] <gdaniels> oops - netsplit
[11/3/2004 10:02 AM] <alek_s> it seems there is lots of engine to discuss so i have put it first next week
[11/3/2004 10:03 AM] <alek_s> oops
[11/3/2004 10:03 AM] <gdaniels> Chinthaka - hm... I'm not sure I buy that
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[11/3/2004 10:03 AM] -->| Srinath (~Srinath@220.247.245.112) has joined #apache-axis
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[11/3/2004 10:03 AM] <Srinath> service,transport,gloabl
[11/3/2004 10:03 AM] <Srinath> operation
[11/3/2004 10:03 AM] <gdaniels> Engine definitely has send/receive... but Transport/Global/Service handlers having two parts (send/receive) is more a deployment issue, I think
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[11/3/2004 10:04 AM] <Srinath> ...are there any more
[11/3/2004 10:04 AM] <Srinath> ?
[11/3/2004 10:04 AM] <Srinath> :)
[11/3/2004 10:04 AM] <alek_s> so one hour is gone - i would say Engine is as good topic to take all time to discuss as OM :)
[11/3/2004 10:04 AM] <alek_s> it seems there is lot to discuss
[11/3/2004 10:04 AM] <Deepal> if we going to resolve handlers at deploymnent time
[11/3/2004 10:04 AM] <gdaniels> +100, Alek :)
[11/3/2004 10:04 AM] <Chinthaka> alek : u r correct :)
[11/3/2004 10:04 AM] <Deepal> we have to think more abt hot update and etc.
[11/3/2004 10:04 AM] <alek_s> i am not sure i can make next meeting (i will be gone)
[11/3/2004 10:04 AM] <Srinath> are we going to codegen them ?
[11/3/2004 10:05 AM] <alek_s> i have put preliminary agenda for next chat to have only Engine discussed
[11/3/2004 10:05 AM] <Srinath> man service
[11/3/2004 10:05 AM] <alek_s> and back toOMin next 2 weeks
[11/3/2004 10:05 AM] <gdaniels> Srinath : codegen Transport/Global/Service you mean?
[11/3/2004 10:05 AM] <alek_s> and of course we can continue discussing things on mailing list :)
[11/3/2004 10:05 AM] <Chinthaka> alek : we can continue discuss abt OM in mailing list
[11/3/2004 10:05 AM] <Srinath> otherwise we have to have send and recive since we migh need tehm sometimes
[11/3/2004 10:05 AM] <Ajith> Yeah We sure can
[11/3/2004 10:05 AM] <alek_s> check http://wiki.apache.org/ws/ChatAgenda
[11/3/2004 10:06 AM] <gdaniels> I don't think so... you could just deploy handlers to "global-send" and "global-receive", right?
[11/3/2004 10:06 AM] <gdaniels> Then the engine knows to call global-send on send() (because that's a phase), and global-receive on receive() (ditto)
[11/3/2004 10:06 AM] <Deepal> glen I dint get u
[11/3/2004 10:07 AM] <gdaniels> Deepal: I'm wondering if we really need a CommonExecutor, because the only thing that might really need send()/receive() APIs is the AxisEngine itself.
[11/3/2004 10:07 AM] <Srinath> yap I take that .. but arethere nothing else to be done in the CE ..than runing handers
[11/3/2004 10:07 AM] <gdaniels> The fact that there is a global send flow and a global receive flow can simply be deployment
[11/3/2004 10:07 AM] <gdaniels> Srinath: that's what I'm wondering
[11/3/2004 10:07 AM] <Ajith> Glen :  that is exactly what I am saying
[11/3/2004 10:07 AM] <Chinthaka> before Alek goes, can we safely shift the times for chats once in two weeks ? :(
[11/3/2004 10:08 AM] <sanjiva> guys let's discuss the chat time
[11/3/2004 10:08 AM] <gdaniels> Chinthaka: was there a time shift discussion?
[11/3/2004 10:08 AM] <sanjiva> no not yet glen
[11/3/2004 10:08 AM] <sanjiva> but now with time change its 8pm here ..
[11/3/2004 10:08 AM] <sanjiva> kinda late
[11/3/2004 10:08 AM] <alek_s> once in *two* weeks?
[11/3/2004 10:08 AM] <Srinath> if common executers do not do anything than executing handlers . we got to give it up
[11/3/2004 10:08 AM] <Ajith> Sanjiva : our Aus friends cannot join the chat at this hour
[11/3/2004 10:08 AM] <Chinthaka> one week morning 8 and next week 8 evening
[11/3/2004 10:08 AM] <sanjiva> no AUS friends
[11/3/2004 10:08 AM] <sanjiva> join!
[11/3/2004 10:09 AM] <sanjiva> oh wait they did even tho its late
[11/3/2004 10:09 AM] <sanjiva> I mean the UK guys never joined
[11/3/2004 10:09 AM] <Srinath> yap Harsh is having a 1-2 pm night chat
[11/3/2004 10:09 AM] <sanjiva> (Ias .. he must be busy)
[11/3/2004 10:09 AM] <gdaniels> 8PM Sri Lanka is 5AM California
[11/3/2004 10:09 AM] <Ajith> they were in but left at 8 saying its 1 at night :D
[11/3/2004 10:09 AM] <Chinthaka> Alek, what I meant was one week morning 8 and next week 8 evening
[11/3/2004 10:09 AM] <gdaniels> are there other west coast US people?
[11/3/2004 10:09 AM] <Chinthaka> glen : so 12 noon
[11/3/2004 10:09 AM] <sanjiva> not yet afaik
[11/3/2004 10:09 AM] <gdaniels> ok
[11/3/2004 10:10 AM] <alek_s> 12 noon of whose time?
[11/3/2004 10:10 AM] <gdaniels> noon Eastern is OK with me once I get back to Boston on Nov 13
[11/3/2004 10:10 AM] <Srinath> what is going happen nooon ?
[11/3/2004 10:10 AM] <alek_s> so what time November 10?
[11/3/2004 10:10 AM] <gdaniels> I thought Sri Lanka was eastern time + 10hours, though?
[11/3/2004 10:10 AM] <alek_s> November 17?
[11/3/2004 10:11 AM] <sanjiva> eastern+11 now
[11/3/2004 10:11 AM] <sanjiva> noon what TZ????
[11/3/2004 10:11 AM] <sanjiva> Noon SL is 1am eastern :)
[11/3/2004 10:11 AM] <Chinthaka> alek 12 noon of Sri lankan time
[11/3/2004 10:11 AM] <sanjiva> a bit late for yall
[11/3/2004 10:11 AM] <sanjiva> how about 10pm eastern = 9am SL?
[11/3/2004 10:11 AM] <sanjiva> every other week ..
[11/3/2004 10:11 AM] <alek_s> 10pm looks good for me
[11/3/2004 10:11 AM] <gdaniels> and 9AM eastern / 8PM Sri Lanka the opposite weeks?
[11/3/2004 10:12 AM] <Chinthaka> thats good
[11/3/2004 10:12 AM] <Jaliya> That is ok with us
[11/3/2004 10:12 AM] <alek_s> let keep *actual* hours on Wiki page and have somebody to post to mailing list one day before to avoid confusions ...
[11/3/2004 10:12 AM] <Ajith> seems ok with me too
[11/3/2004 10:12 AM] <sanjiva> alek: +1
[11/3/2004 10:12 AM] <alek_s> so what is decided?
[11/3/2004 10:12 AM] <gdaniels> alek : I can put together a cron job that automatically mails the list
[11/3/2004 10:12 AM] <Chinthaka> alek : +1
[11/3/2004 10:12 AM] <alek_s> glen: +!
[11/3/2004 10:12 AM] <alek_s> +1
[11/3/2004 10:12 AM] <sanjiva> glen: +1!
[11/3/2004 10:12 AM] <alek_s> sp nect week what time?
[11/3/2004 10:13 AM] <gdaniels> So next week...
[11/3/2004 10:13 AM] <alek_s> 10pm EST?
[11/3/2004 10:13 AM] <Chinthaka> 10pm eastern = 9am SL
[11/3/2004 10:13 AM] <gdaniels> That's 7PM pacific
[11/3/2004 10:13 AM] <sanjiva> next week let's try 10pm EST *on* WEDNESDAY? (That's 9am Thu for us)
[11/3/2004 10:13 AM] <gdaniels> which might be hard
[11/3/2004 10:13 AM] <gdaniels> for those of us (me) at the WSDL meeting
[11/3/2004 10:13 AM] <gdaniels> probably dinner going on then
[11/3/2004 10:13 AM] <sanjiva> ah yes next week ..
[11/3/2004 10:14 AM] <sanjiva> how about cancel for next week? I can't join either ..
[11/3/2004 10:14 AM] <gdaniels> or we can keep it at this time for one more week, then start the switch?
[11/3/2004 10:14 AM] <gdaniels> sanjiva, could you make this time next wk?
[11/3/2004 10:14 AM] <Chinthaka> thats ok glen
[11/3/2004 10:14 AM] <sanjiva> sounds good to me .. that way we can do it from the hotel next week (I'll be there too)
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[11/3/2004 10:15 AM] <gdaniels> Sounds good
[11/3/2004 10:15 AM] <gdaniels> I'll drive down and meet you for chat + breakfast
[11/3/2004 10:15 AM] <sanjiva> glen: sounds good!
[11/3/2004 10:15 AM] <gdaniels> OK, so proposal is SAME time for next week, then the FOLLOWING week we start switching between 9AM and 10PM eastern time
[11/3/2004 10:15 AM] <vakYpollo> I would like to contribute to apache-axis; I'm planning to develop the javadoc -> wsdl:documentation issue.  Do I need to sign a CLA?
[11/3/2004 10:16 AM] <alek_s> we are moving times like we own time machine :)
[11/3/2004 10:16 AM] <gdaniels> 9AM and 7PM SL time
[11/3/2004 10:16 AM] <alek_s> 8PM SL?
[11/3/2004 10:16 AM] <gdaniels> sorry 8PM
[11/3/2004 10:16 AM] <alek_s> i have updaed wiki page with times http://wiki.apache.org/ws/ChatAgenda
[11/3/2004 10:16 AM] <alek_s> please check ...
[11/3/2004 10:17 AM] <gdaniels> vakYpollo: Not at first.  Just submit patches to the list, and committers will commit them for you after review
[11/3/2004 10:17 AM] <gdaniels> vakYpollo: Welcome aboard! :)
[11/3/2004 10:17 AM] <gdaniels> Thanks Alek
[11/3/2004 10:17 AM] <Srinath> shall we quit for this week ?
[11/3/2004 10:17 AM] <vakYpollo> gdaniels: what about copyright? The company where I work will do the contribution.
[11/3/2004 10:18 AM] <vakYpollo> (not personal contribution)
[11/3/2004 10:18 AM] <Chinthaka> shall we call off for the day, we still didn't have the dinner also :( :( :( :( :(
[11/3/2004 10:18 AM] <Srinath> bit late
[11/3/2004 10:18 AM] <Jaliya> Next week shall we discuss about providers and operataion
[11/3/2004 10:18 AM] <gdaniels> vakYpollo: If you have copyright statements on the code, we can't take it. :(
[11/3/2004 10:18 AM] <gdaniels> We need the Apache license on each file, and no other
[11/3/2004 10:18 AM] <Ajith> sure BTW I am starving :D
[11/3/2004 10:18 AM] <gdaniels> enjoy dinner, guys!
[11/3/2004 10:18 AM] <vakYpollo> gdaniels: okz. I'll check out that. tnx!
[11/3/2004 10:18 AM] <gdaniels> I'm going to find breakfast. :)
[11/3/2004 10:19 AM] <Srinath> we all seem to insame boat .. starving :D
[11/3/2004 10:19 AM] <Srinath> in same
[11/3/2004 10:19 AM] <gdaniels> Alek, you going to post the log?
[11/3/2004 10:19 AM] <Chinthaka> see u all next week
[11/3/2004 10:19 AM] <Srinath> bye ..
[11/3/2004 10:19 AM] <Ajith> see you Byeeeeee
[11/3/2004 10:19 AM] <gdaniels> bye all!
[11/3/2004 10:19 AM] <Chinthaka> byeee
[11/3/2004 10:19 AM] <Deepal> bye all
[11/3/2004 10:20 AM] <Jaliya> see you , bye all

ChatAgenda/20041103/ChatLog (last edited 2009-09-20 22:47:56 by localhost)